Banks and governments using shame tactics to keep people stuck in debt slavery

[kopperhead]

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2009/10/government-and-lender-policies-of-fear.html

from breakin news on JDD's page.   makes me sick....makes us all sick, i know.

wanna hear what you guys think/feel/have to rant....talk to me, babies.

ADMINISTRATIVE ADDITION:

Have added the abstract here - I think this is really important stuff. Not just control of people's money but of people's emotions! One of the reasons there hasn't been mass debtors revolt is people still think the banks are oh so powerful, that the banks can squash them like bugs should even raise a peep. Even the debtor's revolt woman only got her credit card interest rate down to 13%, and that is considered a victory even though it really isn't much of one. (as 13% interest is still very high) But if people in a typical middle class neighborhood would get together and tell the banks they have loans to "either lower our payments to X% of our monthly income or we *all* stop paying" they'd see how powerless the banks actually are.

They've done a particularly good job with us men. Getting us to equate making the monthly mortgage bondage payment with our sense of masculinity.

Emphasis mine:

Despite reports that homeowners are increasingly “walking away” from their mortgages, most homeowners continue to make their payments even when they are significantly underwater. This article suggests that most homeowners choose not to strategically default as a result of two emotional forces: 1) the desire to avoid the shame and guilt of foreclosure; and 2) exaggerated anxiety over foreclosure’s perceived consequences. Moreover, these emotional constraints are actively cultivated by the government and other social control agents in order to encourage homeowners to follow social and moral norms related to the honoring of financial obligations - and to ignore market and legal norms under which strategic default might be both viable and the wisest financial decision. Norms governing homeowner behavior stand in sharp contrast to norms governing lenders, who seek to maximize profits or minimize losses irrespective of concerns of morality or social responsibility. This norm asymmetry leads to distributional inequalities in which individual homeowners shoulder a disproportionate burden from the housing collapse.

[Phildo]

Good analysis that  Banks/Corporations are totally amoral creations.

Endowed with mandate of their creators to return maximum profit.

Hell of a system we have built.

[pamela]

It's almost laughable isn't it?
They sure have us by the short and curlies don't they?

[FilterFeeder]

Thanks for that link:

It's interesting how the foolish masses are manipulated by moral considerations, while financial institutions behave utterly immorally to the extent of utter criminality and everyone accepts it as "business". Then when these very same institutions effectively piss all over their own scam through run away greed - it is the foolish masses which have to pay out hand over fist to save them. It's obscene. It's criminal.

Those banks should all have been made to suffer the consequences, let the system reset, apply the same mantra of "market forces" which was so often cited in the boom years to justify their amoral behaviour back at them and cheerfully watch them burn to the ground.

But "Too big to fail" is basically a euphemism for "Too powerful to ignore". Follow the money - the system is run by the rich for the rich anyone outside of that is a pleb to be pacified by mindless entertainment and cheap drugs. To be manipulated by various forms of grand illusions variously referred to as democracy, justice, freedom and capitalism. Privatise the benefits and socialise the costs through lies, deception and manipulation.

The system in its present form is unsustainable. Collapse will make things more local, more personal, more accountable. It's the only logical answer.
 

[Arraya]

I bet this works better than debtors prisons or indentured servitude. 

[JurisDoctorOfDoom]

I bet this works better than debtors prisons or indentured servitude. 

Yes! and it's not unlike sexual abuse in a weird way in that people usually just deal with their shame and fear by themselves and behind closed doors. but in a way it's even worse as there's all sorts of help groups and therapies for the shame and fear that sexual abuse creates in people but almost nothing for the shame and fear people end up internalizing as a result of their perceived financial failings. (To be clear I'm not completely equating the two, just making a very general comparison) The shame and fear in regards to perceived financial failure is so widespread in American men I'd say it's an epidemic and unlike other epidemics (sexual abuse, for instance) it's not talked about or dealt with at all.

[metaforge]

I bet this works better than debtors prisons or indentured servitude. 

Indeed.  Two main reasons: 1) the mind is much more powerful than any cage with bars.  2) hard to repay a debt if you're in a cage.

Great link by the way, thanks for sharing.

[kopperhead]

thanks for the addition/fleshin out of my post JDD... as an empath, i feel pain tremendously. however, i get all twisted up, and have trouble verbalizin what i feel needs to be said sometimes.

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2009/10/government-and-lender-policies-of-fear.html

from breakin news on JDD's page.   makes me sick....makes us all sick, i know.

wanna hear what you guys think/feel/have to rant....talk to me, babies.

ADMINISTRATIVE ADDITION:

Have added the abstract here - I think this is really important stuff. Not just control of people's money but of people's emotions! One of the reasons there hasn't been mass debtors revolt is people still think the banks are oh so powerful, that the banks can squash them like bugs should even raise a peep. Even the debtor's revolt woman only got her credit card interest rate down to 13%, and that is considered a victory even though it really isn't much of one. (as 13% interest is still very high) But if people in a typical middle class neighborhood would get together and tell the banks they have loans to "either lower our payments to X% of our monthly income or we *all* stop paying" they'd see how powerless the banks actually are.

They've done a particularly good job with us men. Getting us to equate making the monthly mortgage bondage payment with our sense of masculinity.

Emphasis mine:

Despite reports that homeowners are increasingly “walking away” from their mortgages, most homeowners continue to make their payments even when they are significantly underwater. This article suggests that most homeowners choose not to strategically default as a result of two emotional forces: 1) the desire to avoid the shame and guilt of foreclosure; and 2) exaggerated anxiety over foreclosure’s perceived consequences. Moreover, these emotional constraints are actively cultivated by the government and other social control agents in order to encourage homeowners to follow social and moral norms related to the honoring of financial obligations - and to ignore market and legal norms under which strategic default might be both viable and the wisest financial decision. Norms governing homeowner behavior stand in sharp contrast to norms governing lenders, who seek to maximize profits or minimize losses irrespective of concerns of morality or social responsibility. This norm asymmetry leads to distributional inequalities in which individual homeowners shoulder a disproportionate burden from the housing collapse.

[Possum]

I think this is rapidly changing.  According to the USA Today article that is linked on the Breaking News Page today, debtors who *know someone* who has defaulted are much more likely to do it themselves, or at least say they will.  Pretty soon almost everyone in the country will *know someone* that has gone down this road. 

If you throw in the folks we *know* virtually through boards like this, there is not much hope for a housing recovery.  Or any other kind of recovery.

[Arraya]

I think this is rapidly changing.  According to the USA Today article that is linked on the Breaking News Page today, debtors who *know someone* who has defaulted are much more likely to do it themselves, or at least say they will.  Pretty soon almost everyone in the country will *know someone* that has gone down this road. 

If you throw in the folks we *know* virtually through boards like this, there is not much hope for a housing recovery.  Or any other kind of recovery.

I agree, it will happen eventually.  Herd mentality will take hold and look out below.  I'm actually expecting it at some point.   

There is like 20 million upside down mortgages in the country. Imagine the amount of mental anguish out there, causing marital problems, stressed out because a spouse lost a job, kids getting neglected and feeling the wrath of their parents stress.  It's a time bomb waiting to happen. 

I figure once the DOW takes another hit, it will knock quite a few off the fence and it will spiral after that.

If people start walking en masse, I hate to see what the banker sycophants in DC will come up with.  What a nightmare.

[houseoftang]

This isn't really new, though.  They've long used guilt and fear and shame to get people to do what they want, be it buy the newest product or keep paying for it.

Sometimes it blows my mind how long we've all been bought and sold.

[metaforge]

I think the article missed a 3rd important reason people stay & keep paying... not just guilt, but they honestly love their house.  Maybe it's near neighbors, family, good school - whatever the reason.   They think as long as I have my job, the same job I had when I signed on for the payment, what's the big deal?  It'll recover value eventually, at least back to break even.  I bet there are a lot of people like that.  Afterall the mindset is that until you've sold an asset, you haven't lost any money.  Now, with what we all know, we know there is little chance in hell of a breakeven, but have to remember 99% of the population is life as usual.   As long as they keep the boss happy, it'll be the other guy that gets let go, they'll keep the McMansion, and everything will be fine.

[joewp]

I think the article missed a 3rd important reason people stay & keep paying... not just guilt, but they honestly love their house.  Maybe it's near neighbors, family, good school - whatever the reason.   They think as long as I have my job, the same job I had when I signed on for the payment, what's the big deal?  It'll recover value eventually, at least back to break even.  I bet there are a lot of people like that.  Afterall the mindset is that until you've sold an asset, you haven't lost any money.  Now, with what we all know, we know there is little chance in hell of a breakeven, but have to remember 99% of the population is life as usual.   As long as they keep the boss happy, it'll be the other guy that gets let go, they'll keep the McMansion, and everything will be fine.

I agree, and people remember the housing boom and crash in the 1980s and figure that in 10 years they'll be back in the black on their house.

Of course, they don't know what we know. But time will tell them what we know, and many will either stop paying and walk away, or stop paying and stay. How many can the local sheriff evict when even he is upside down and thinking about stopping his mortgage payment?

[Megadoom]

HOW DARE THEY!!!

[mtlouie]

Here's a history lesson I learned today.

Went to the library to watch 'Tecumseh's Vision.'    They outright showed that Jefferson used debt slavery against the Native Americans to get their land "legally."  Got them to "trade" furs for white folks stuff:  clothes, pots, beads, etc. etc. etc.   Then talked them into taking more than they had furs to trade for "to pay for later."  Then they couldn't come up with the furs and ended up trading land to take care of their "debts."


It's been the same shit over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.    And we all just keep taking it.


A friend of mine said something tonight that was quite interesting:  "They can't do anything to us that we don't go along with.  We are helping them to enslave us."