US Natural Gas Potential has been Overrated

[shaleoh2]

Here is an NPR story on the impact from drilling the Barnett Shale.

^{http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=120043996&sc=emaf}

WOW. smells like that is one great big nauseating headache

[shaleoh2]

So big oil turned to big gas another fossil fuel clean to burn,
but one of the most toxic industries in the world to extract ?? ?? ?

AH but another way to get less dependent on foreign oil …. YEAH RIGHT
This is gunna work really well. OR NOT really.

Natural gas accounts for just 22 percent of the nation's energy consumption. Natural gas advocates say that increased use would mean a cleaner environment and less dependence on foreign oil.

Gastar Exploration, a small Texas company, is digging a shallow natural gas well in Clarksburg, W.Va. Gastar's business strategy is to limit its exploration and drilling to a minimum in the Appalachian region until it sees how larger gas companies fare in the area.


The agility of small companies is an important strength in a field where the ability to move fast is key to maintaining a competitive edge. But there is also a more practical reason small companies dominate the U.S. natural gas business. Typically, a new gas well produces in abundance in the year after it's opened, but then production begins to decline. If a natural gas company is to keep production and revenue steady, it has to keep drilling new wells. The energy majors may not have the patience for that effort.

Paradoxically, the biggest energy companies follow a similar strategy, though in their case they try to shift risk to their smaller rivals. Shale production in the United States looks so promising right now that the big oil companies are thinking about getting back into the natural gas business. Exxon, for example, is looking at some possible shale "plays" in the United States, but — like Gastar — the company is biding its time before making a big move.

"We can live on the fringes if necessary," he says. Or Gastar could just let the big oil companies take over some of its gas operations — for the right price.  

here we  go some more, can big oil companies really turn into big gas now?

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=113080237#commentBlock

[Xenopus]

Unconventional gas relies heavily on frac-ing (fracking). I watched this this documentary on the impact of the process and I honestly must say it made me sick. It paints a sincerely horrifying look at the consequences of the chemicals that are pumped in the ground along with the water that makes up "frac-ing fluid". The trailer does not even do the documentary justice in terms of how fucking sad and eye-opening it is. Certainly gives one pause if you are planning on buying that doomstead without the mineral rights to the land.

I am in the natural gas distribution side of the business, and I have avoided posting too much industry specific details of what my perceptions are for a number of reasons.

Let me just say that I don't think that some of the best, biggest and brightest entities on the gas distribution side of things would not have spent a mint on LNG receiving terminals and re-gassification plants if they thought tight or shale gas would solve future supply problems. I am not saying that LNG is 'the" solution, just that it wouldn't be ready to go into play if other unconventional gas was the solution. 

Yes, indeed. We're on Marcellus Shale and we turned down a couple of doomsteads because they had gas leases on them.

Someone has just pulled together all the drilling accidents in NY in the past 30 years:
http://www.theithacajournal.com/article/20091108/NEWS01/911080372&referrer=FRONTPAGECAROUSEL

The state's depiction of a clean, tightly regulated natural gas industry just got a shot of muck in the eye.

As the debate over the merits of Marcellus Shale development reaches a crescendo, an Ithaca researcher has culled a list of 270 files documenting wastewater spills, well contamination, explosions, methane migration and ecological damage related to gas production in the state since 1979.

We used to live near an LNG terminal on the Savannah River. It was expanding quite rapidly. I'd rather live near that than near hydrofracking.

I bet you're right that unconventional NG really isn't ready for prime time, in lots of ways.

[Satori]

hydraulic fracturing in the news again
and it ain't good

all the natural gas you want
as long as you don't mind ruining your water supply

http://www.examiner.com/x-28586-Chicago-Environmental-News-Examiner~y2009m11d11-Peak-Oil-Should-Still-Worry-You-The-Hot-Air-in-New-Natural-Gas-Estimates

[wordnerd]

Gas is going to becoming a 'too" expensive way to heat our homes.
Geothermal is too expensive to install
There is not enough firewood and coal for the number of people alive today who will need it
Does anyone remember that scene at the beginning of Dr. Zhivago where he is arrested for stealing a board to burn to heat their apartment? Are we approaching that scenario?

[J.A.F.O.]

So all of Jeromie's optimism turns out to be the grasping at straws I suspected it was?  Why am I not surprised?

[Xenopus]

So all of Jeromie's optimism turns out to be the grasping at straws I suspected it was?  Why am I not surprised?

No. The promise of gas may have been overhyped. (That's what you do when you want to get people to invest in something.) But the gas is very real. I've made a nice chunk of change from it, thanks to Jeromie.   

Arrogant Perps report that natural gas prices fell 12% in November as the economy bites and the weather stays mild. That makes it even harder to get the money to dig the wells.

[J.A.F.O.]

You missed the point totally.. Jeromie's beef was that it would 'save' America..  and he got his diapers in a knot when several people called him out on that BS.  (not to mention his refusal to ever acknowledge the reality of PO)

[Xenopus]

You missed the point totally.. Jeromie's beef was that it would 'save' America..  and he got his diapers in a knot when several people called him out on that BS.  (not to mention his refusal to ever acknowledge the reality of PO)

America having gas is certainly a lot better off than countries like the UK that don't have gas and are hostage to the Russian pipeline. Nobody ever said it would 'save' America. It merely buys us time to get our energy house in order. This could be done. Denmark went from importing most of its energy in the 1970s to exporting it today. It seems to me unlikely that the US will show the sort of will power and discipline that such a change requires, but I suppose one can always hope.

Of course Jeromie acknowledged PO. You are as stupid as Seahorse. You might ask yourself what you mean by PO. peakoil.com defines it as 'The midpoint of global hydrocarbon production.' Under that definition (which includes all fossil fuels), we're not there yet. On the other hand, if you define it as oil that can be produced for under $20 a barrel, we probably reached that peak in summer 2008. etc.

[gasman]

US does have a lot of gas, but it imports about two thirds of Canada's production right now. If unconventional gas production was not so damn destructive then I would be happier about the situation. Look, I distribute the stuff for a living. I love the stuff as far as what it's positives are versus other forms of energy, but it certainly isn't going to save our ass because it is still a resource that we won't have in another generation in the quantities needed to smooth transition to some miracle energy economy.

The "Pickins Plan" school of thought where we use natural gas to bridge us the next energy solution is doomed to fail. NGVs are great. They have the technology down pat. Bi-fuel vehicles that can switch from gasoline to natural gas run very well these days and have for years, but there has been no significant push in decades to transition to these types of vehicles. Oil has been too cheap for too long and that has effectively killed widespread use of NGVs along with any other alternate energy use vehicles. Now we are simply too far down the infrastructure sinkhole to do anything meaningful about the situation. Even if we had the money to invest in a grand scale repowering of vehicles and the infrastructure to support them, the endgame is already upon us.

Yes, it is an energy source problem, but it is a also a problem of scale, scope, money, and most importantly, time. I'm glad that some folks made a few bucks following Jeromie's advice, but it doesn't amount to problem fixed. The choice is pretty simple for us at this point in time. Change the way we live, or wait and have that change forced upon us. Unfortunately the world leadership does not see it quite this way. They have already made the choice to continue down the path we are taking and skim as much off the top on the slide down while quietly preparing on their own. What does that tell you? It tells me that they don't give a rat's ass whether the common man has a soft landing or not. Perhaps they would rather that we didn't.

[Seahorse]

Well said Gasman.

[Xenopus]

Yes, it is an energy source problem, but it is a also a problem of scale, scope, money, and most importantly, time. I'm glad that some folks made a few bucks following Jeromie's advice, but it doesn't amount to problem fixed. The choice is pretty simple for us at this point in time. Change the way we live, or wait and have that change forced upon us. Unfortunately the world leadership does not see it quite this way. They have already made the choice to continue down the path we are taking and skim as much off the top on the slide down while quietly preparing on their own. What does that tell you? It tells me that they don't give a rat's ass whether the common man has a soft landing or not. Perhaps they would rather that we didn't.

I'm afraid I agree with that.

[suburban_junkscape]

you can describe the massive new natural gas supplies in one word: too little, too late

[Satori]

drill baby drill ??

well maybe not so much

do we want natural gas so badly that we
will pollute our water supply to get it??

http://money.cnn.com/2009/12/02/news/economy/drilling/index.htm

[maurice]

Where I am the gas industry seems to have problems.  They closed the fertilizer plant due to lack of gas.  Then they raised our gas bills by 20% each of the last few years.  They burn gas here to make electricity.  Now they say we  might have rolling brownouts this winter and we even had a test to see how much could be saved one evening by everyone shutting the heat down and lights off.  Meanwhile the city seems to have excess energy use everywhere and they just installed a obnoxious street light next to my yard that illuminates the whole area all night long.  They are planning to shut electricity off in shifts knowing damn well some furnaces will not click back on in some vacant houses causing thousands of property damage in the deep cold part of the winter meanwhile wasting electricity with useless light all night every night when the purpose I am sure is to illuminate the 15 minutes in the morning kids wait for the bus there.  Then to top off the lunacy they decided that even with the threat of rolling brownouts etc they would reduce the gas rates 16% this winter.

I just got a bid for a geothermal furnace system.  $30,000 instead of the $9000 or so for a gas system.

Jeez. That all sounds amazingly hairy. I wish we had installed a geothermal system years ago. My cousin did and it keeps their house at the same temperature winter and summer with v. low energy use. On the other hand, I know people who have had trouble with these systems. I don't think we can afford to go for it at the moment.

A convenional HVAC contractor or architect  may not be qualified to design a geothermal system. It may take a qualified professional engineer.