Please help! Graduating Senior son in May!

[maurice]

There are a few places in the US where it is possible to work while being immersed in a
a non-English-speaking environment.

For example, Spanish in Miami or Puerto Rica or New Mexico, Portuguese in Framingham MA
or Rhode Island, Russian in Brooklyn, Chinese in chinatowns in Los Angeles and elsewhere,
French in Louisiana or northern Maine, Dutch in Holland MI. Can anybody contribute other
examples?

[mes228]

Just a few comments from a Father that has 5 children ranging from 34 to 9 years old (two marriages). There used to be a "demarcation" line between being a child and a "man". Most societies I believe have some type of ritual or quest etc. that a child passes through to become a "man". The USA used to have a vague "adult hood" ritual. In this country the norm used to be that you graduated High School at 18 and you were considered an adult "man" and assumed adult responsibilities and a job. Many married at that approx. age and had children which required them to mature. Or went into the military. These things marked the transition from child to man. These things also encouraged maturity. That has changed. At 18 most young men now go to college and continue "playing" with little responsibility for 4 or more years and graduate with an educational "mortgage" in school loans. Not necessarily a job, nor necessarily mature. Many delay marriage until the late twenties or early thirties. This also delays maturing into an adult. I discovered too late for my eldest 3 children that college, maturity, adulthood do not necessarily "run" together. There are no "rituals" or lines of demarcation anymore that a child passes through to become an adult. My 4th child entered the Air Force. The change was and is astounding. He became a "man and adult" in just a few months. I think a major thing the AF training did was the "ritual" of requiring him to become an "adult" with adult responsibilities. It was expected by the entire enviroment he was in. He was expected to "man up" under a challenging situations. And he did. Parents could never accomplish what they did. Even if they tried they would be jailed. As an aside, for many years I had a built in dislike for the military as my only Brother was killed in Vietnam. I also opposed war on religious grounds. So I never even considered any military options for my children. I now feel I did them a dis-service. I still would not want a child to go in the Marines or Army and be involved in ground combat. Or living in the conditions they have in war. At this point the AF seems to be a different story all together. I realize it's still the machinery of war. And in the years of Iraq about 450 have perished. However our military is presumably for the "defense" of our country so I can live with his service. I guess the point to this rambling response is "a young man needs some type of line, or symbol, or thing that marks his transition from child to man". In my sons life the AF did this and I am amazed at the result. I suggest you look for some type of challenging school, or skill set, that marks the "break" from being your "child" to being a "man" in his own right when he completes it. College in no way does this. Young people graduate and are pitifully clueless and lost for the most part.

[kathleen]

I suggest you look for some type of challenging school, or skill set, that marks the "break" from being your "child" to being a "man" in his own right when he completes it. College in no way does this. Young people graduate and are pitifully clueless and lost for the most part.

Thank you for the thought put into that post; I agree, there is no clear line of demarcation between childhood and adulthood for this generation.
We've all seen examples of that protracted adolescence.
I'm sure all of those sustainable cultures came up with those rites of passage for a reason--because it worked. You've given me some new topics to think about and I appreciate it.

[MEA]

Please keep us update.

[MissMachinegun]

Someone suggested having him move to a college town and instead of enrolling right away, instead just work and live and live the "college experience" without the debt.

That's how I came to Lawrence  partially at least. It might not be a bad idea, in my case, I did decide to attend school later on--3 semesters at JCCC (great cc btw), and by the time I enrolled there, the partying was out of my system and I was able to focus better not just on classwork, but also my motivations for going and thinking deeply about what I wanted to do with an education. I discovered there wasn't any degree that spoke to me so I never went back after the third semester, but I did figure it out without having to go in debt--or put my parents in debt. Also read some good books, too, and learned a smidgen of piano.

[MissMachinegun]

<<My son has said that she only shows an interest in kids who show up in her office essentially indicating that they will be going to an expensive college. She'll dick around and find them a couple of 300 dollar scholarships, but that's about it. There's no real help for kids looking for other paths. Why are guidance counselors so often like that? Weird. I'm sure there must be some good ones out there-I hope....>>

That's how the guidance counselors were at my HS too. Not going to university? You're invisible.

[illingsk]

I need help! I need the expertise of young people who have been out there trying to find their way in this mess. My son will be graduating this May from HS. He is an average student (mainly because, if I am honest, he doesn't try all that hard unless it interests him-then he's very bright). He has no idea what he wants to do, and he is getting some very bad advice from friends. Many of them are planning to go to college without an indication of what they might want to do and are simply planning on doing the student loan thing. We are not wealthy, our son would need to do the same to afford even state tuition due to the massive increases of late.

I've certainly been remiss in imparting the appropriate level of concern for the future on our son. We had him when we were young (I was 22) and I think he's been able to sense the shakiness of our wisdom through the years, the way that the oldest kids always can. Younger siblings don't know better, mom and dad are more solid in their behavior by the time they show up. I really felt that the future was looking so dismal that I wanted to give him the gift of a relatively normal, fright-free childhood, lord knows there's going to be terrible stuff in the future, but I know I should have prepared him better.  I have talked about the shaky future lately, the inherent instability of it all, and in increasing doses, but I really don't think he has taken it in. There are just too many influences (relatives, friends) who impart a BAU philosophy and it is easy for him to dismiss mom and dad as batty. I don't want him to go into debt, hell, if he wanted to do something fairly random (but something he loved)---I'd try to help, but he is just floundering and trying to emulate friends who don't have great plans.

Can any of you impart some wisdom or even cautionary tales that I can relay to him? PM me if you don't want to put details on here. I am just hoping to reach him and get him to realize that there are others who think like me; that don't believe in getting into debt for marginal (or no) benefits. I would seriously back him up more if he came up with something like "mom, I want to scuba dive or learn how to be a blacksmith!!!), but this, "mom, I don't know what I want to do, but I think I'd like to take out loans and take some core classes and see what happens....."  That strikes me as so wrong right now!

Please don't encourage me to send him to the military or give other snotty comments; it's a serious topic, just don't bother if you don't want to help. I'm really looking to those in this age group for their thoughts, not boomers and gen x'ers like me who would encourage someone to duplicate their experiences since I don't think that is possible any longer. I know I am guilty of making light of many issues, but I am being completely earnest in asking this age group what they think. 

Consider reading with him some books on the Great Depression. Or, Kunstler's World Made by Hand. Any decison you make, try to grade it by the following criteria: 1) Is it good for everyone, not just yourself or just your country. 2) Is it good for the environment and not just your species. and 3) Does it help improve the general awareness and compassion for being as oppposed to being good for just some religious institution. HTH

[kathleen]

Thank you again for all of the wise suggestions. We are at something of an impasse at this point so I'm taking a hiatus from pestering him at least until after his 18th birthday next month. I became pretty testy with some remarks on this thread; that was my fault. I might be putting too much of myself into a decision that is ultimately his. It's pretty difficult when you just want someone to avoid obvious mistakes like debt or less obvious ones like you've made yourself. Ones that you can't fully articulate. My husband and I have wildly differing world views so there is no common ground to work from in giving advice at this point. No wonder the poor kid is conflicted with that kind of discord probably in his own mind! I appreciate the responses I've received from this question; I truly do.

This is going to be a common concern and very soon. We are just now starting to receive all of those college graduates who have done "everything right" and they have uncertain futures. If you have children, you're going to have to be concerned with this. I would like to think in all of these years I've gained some wisdom to impart, but if I'm being honest, I don't think I know a damn thing more. This stuff would be difficult without slow crash scenarios at play.

This is an aside, but I was thinking about a book I really love, All the King's Men. It's been awhile since I read it, but I remember something in it to the effect that someone can't be a writer until they realize the implications of the cruel passage of time. Along those lines (not necessarily anything about being a writer) you just want your child to understand the implications of passing time and to make the most of it. I don't know if that makes any sense 

I have read all of the responses and thank you again 

[HueyLewis]

kathleen this was a good thread on an extremely important issue.  Hopefully, when the issue is more a "common concern" as you point out, it won't be as stressful for families to deal with, knowing so many others are going through the same thing. 

[kathleen]

Thanks, Huey  , like I told you, I felt kinda silly bringing up the question....
I am bewildered that it isn't brought up more often. I guess I'm always on the forefront of doom related angst