Heating a van home?

[LuaHasFreedom]

My brother in law died because he ran a coleman lantern in a van that didn't have enough air intake.

[Diogenes]

The big thing is insulation, my old van was lined with styrofoam and it didn't take much to heat it up at all, works even better if you put up a barrier between the frontseats and the back. Here's a link to the way it was done by sheep herders.
[/url]http://tinyhouseblog.com/stick-built/sheep-wagons/[url]

[Fishsurfer]

You could just use candles, they actual heat up small spaces pretty well.  Obviously a fire hazard, so it would be a good idea to build a metal box that holds a candle up against the side of the van, up out of the way so you dont roll on it with a sleeping bag.  Wax is cheap, you can make your own candles. 

Honestly though, from my experience in cold weather survival school, if you simply invest in good clothing and dress in layers, you wont get that cold or uncomfortable after a few weeks of doing it. 

If you've ever been to Alaska, you'll see people walking around in T-shirts, not because they are poor, but because they are used to cold weather and 30 degrees is like an indian summer. 

My location can get very cold at time, below zero a few times a year.  Typically its the 20's or 30's most days.  Ive got a selection of military grade wool overshirts/sweaters, thinsulate thermal layers and long underwear, gloves with a liner (very important), and a good stash of wool caps, wool socks and quality leather boots.  Wearing that in layers will work just fine in a van.  Staying out of the wind will be the best thing you can do once the sun goes down.  So with that in mind, id keep a good collection of books you've always wanted to read but havent, and just read by candle light at night. 

I think a hot rock would be a good idea at night in combo with a quality sleeping bag.  If you just stick it in down by your feet, a nice dry rock that is, not an explosive wet/hot rock, it will keep you toasty all night.  Like you said, its not going to be an easy thing to have a fire, but when you can do it just for morale purposes. 

[akaskip]

The big thing is insulation, my old van was lined with styrofoam and it didn't take much to heat it up at all, works even better if you put up a barrier between the frontseats and the back. Here's a link to the way it was done by sheep herders.
[/url]http://tinyhouseblog.com/stick-built/sheep-wagons/

  [url]http://tinyhouseblog.com/stick-built/sheep-wagons/]

  http://tinyhouseblog.com/stick-built/sheep-wagons/

   fixed the link for ya.

[Broil]

My brother in law died because he ran a coleman lantern in a van that didn't have enough air intake.

Yes, that's why I'm leary of unvented heaters, aside from the issue of needing to go buy fuel.

The big thing is insulation, my old van was lined with styrofoam and it didn't take much to heat it up at all, works even better if you put up a barrier between the frontseats and the back. Here's a link to the way it was done by sheep herders.
[/url]http://tinyhouseblog.com/stick-built/sheep-wagons/[url]

Seems like a good idea.  Maybe I could use some of those spray-on insulation products ..... though I've heard they give off toxic fumes.

You could just use candles, they actual heat up small spaces pretty well.  Obviously a fire hazard, so it would be a good idea to build a metal box that holds a candle up against the side of the van, up out of the way so you dont roll on it with a sleeping bag.  Wax is cheap, you can make your own candles. 

Honestly though, from my experience in cold weather survival school, if you simply invest in good clothing and dress in layers, you wont get that cold or uncomfortable after a few weeks of doing it. 

If you've ever been to Alaska, you'll see people walking around in T-shirts, not because they are poor, but because they are used to cold weather and 30 degrees is like an indian summer. 

My location can get very cold at time, below zero a few times a year.  Typically its the 20's or 30's most days.  Ive got a selection of military grade wool overshirts/sweaters, thinsulate thermal layers and long underwear, gloves with a liner (very important), and a good stash of wool caps, wool socks and quality leather boots.  Wearing that in layers will work just fine in a van.  Staying out of the wind will be the best thing you can do once the sun goes down.  So with that in mind, id keep a good collection of books you've always wanted to read but havent, and just read by candle light at night. 

I think a hot rock would be a good idea at night in combo with a quality sleeping bag.  If you just stick it in down by your feet, a nice dry rock that is, not an explosive wet/hot rock, it will keep you toasty all night.  Like you said, its not going to be an easy thing to have a fire, but when you can do it just for morale purposes. 

My experience from living in a tent is just the opposite, that even dressing in layers and having a good sleeping bag doesn't allow you to get warm after several days, although if you can get showers and laundry done the insulation seems to perk right up and work again (yes, even with synthetic fabrics).

But I would need a good candle to read by, unless I get one of those crank/solar/ radios. 

I remember insulation kept me warm when I lived in the van in temps that went down to 17f at night, but that was in dry weather with no wind.

[Onidah]

Coleman and others make catalytic heaters that burn propane or butane without a flame and are supposed to be safe for use indoors.  

http://www.coleman.com/coleman/colemancom/detail.asp?product_id=5035A750&categoryid=3000&brand=

I have no experience with them indoors so am not recommending them.  If I were to use them in a tent or van, I would definitely also use a working carbon monoxide detector/alarm.  

The safer way would be to use a similar device to heat water outside the vehicle and transfer the heat to the inside of the tent/van with a water loop.  But, I'm not aware of an affordable commercial device that does this.    If there is much interest in such a device, I would consider building and offering them for sale though.  I would guess the cost to be around $500.  

But, I've been snow camping before.  While the cold may be uncomfortable, you won't freeze as long as you have an adequately rated sleeping bag.  (I consider my north face darkstar -40 F rated bag to be comfortable down to about 0.)

The concept is good.  This water heater might be a little large for this application, but it would allow you to heat the water outside the vehicle and then run the heat through a water loop in the van.  Or, rather than a water loop, just connect the two hoses from the water heater placed at ground level outside the van into a small tank on the inside of the van at a higher level.  Some extra insulation of some sort on the outside tank would help keep the water in the system warm when the fire died down.  This hot water could also be used for dishes, laundry, and showers.

http://www.lehmans.com/store/Stoves___Cook_Stoves___Hot_Water_From_Your_Stove___Hot_Water___System_Two___26845?Args=#

Here is another option:

http://www.cedartubsdirect.com/chofu-wood-fired-hot-tub-heater-no-electricity-required-p-30.html

Perhaps Zac could make smaller versions of these devices for even less than the $500 mentioned.

Onidah

[Broil]

If you're going to heat the water outside the van anyway, say with propane, you can simply heat it in a large stockpot and bring it into the van, then cover it in a blanket so the heat will release slowly.  No need to pipe it.  Maybe I could heat it on a woodfire most of the time, but try to have some propane around for bad weather.

I do this in my cottage when I think it's likely that high winds will knock out the power on cold nights.  Everything is electric here, so I heat up the stockpot full of water as described above, and set it down on my bedroom floor.  It works very well.

[DonTron]

Vented propane heater, good for a 200 sq ft cabin, so undoubtedly good for a poorly insulated van:

http://www.asapheat.com/eskabe.htm

[Onidah]

If you're going to heat the water outside the van anyway, say with propane, you can simply heat it in a large stockpot and bring it into the van, then cover it in a blanket so the heat will release slowly.  No need to pipe it.  Maybe I could heat it on a woodfire most of the time, but try to have some propane around for bad weather.

I do this in my cottage when I think it's likely that high winds will knock out the power on cold nights.  Everything is electric here, so I heat up the stockpot full of water as described above, and set it down on my bedroom floor.  It works very well.

The advantage to the water heater and the piping is that it is much more efficient since the water completely surrounds the fire.  Think of it like one of those outside wood burners that some people attach to their house, only on a much smaller scale.

[Broil]

Oh, it doesn't need to be efficient if I'm using wood, which will be free since I'd be squatting in a large forest, and there's only a tiny space to heat.  But it's a good idea in case I build a hut or yurt or whatever.

[madison]

How about making a small enclosure with strawbales around the van, with a side square enclosing a small woodburning stove?  Think of an "L" - the van "I" and the woodstove end "_".  Then keep a window open to capture the heat, and a window cracked at the other end to suction it through the vehicle. 

[hisbeatnik]

Pre TSHTF, I've done it. (and in the Northern Midwest, and for weeks). I know this is rather simple, but:
* Sub Zero Sleeping Bag
* Electric Ceramic Heater w/ tip over sensor / thermosat
* Park on Concrete / Asphalt surfaces, these radiate heat from the day (helps but not necessary)

However, if you're talking about heating not just when you sleep, you'll have to focus more on insulating yourself. Some folks make the mistake of not insulating their vans when they coat the interior with Carpet / Formica  (wouldn't recommend Formica - when van gets hot can give off toxic fumes). This can help a great deal.

POST TSHTF,
Well, that's the main reason I'm on this part of LATOC... let me know what you find out.

[FilterFeeder]

I had a mate who built his own woodstove for his truck out of a fire extinguisher welded to a steel plate on the floor and a small door cut into the side of it to feed the fire. Had a vent beneath the grate to draw outside air. Only needed a few sticks of wood to get everything really toasty. The only downside to it was that there was no hot plate to boil a kettle on it.

The problem with most wood burners is that they're just too big for a van. Think small.

I appreciate your concerns re CO poisoning, and Lua's post is quite sobering. I reckon if the stove draws really well, e.g. with a cold air feed, and you have a CO alarm in the van, you'll be OK.

Propane heaters put out a lot of water vapour - damp is one of the biggest problems with van living.

[hisbeatnik]

I had a mate who built his own woodstove for his truck out of a fire extinguisher welded to a steel plate on the floor and a small door cut into the side of it to feed the fire. Had a vent beneath the grate to draw outside air. Only needed a few sticks of wood to get everything really toasty. The only downside to it was that there was no hot plate to boil a kettle on it.

Good Stuff

[three]

This may give you some ideas.

http://www.marinestove.com/