Missing Gold at the Comex? (Serious Doom *and* Major Shenanigans)

[ArmaGoof]

Exactly!  It inflates til it bursts.  Sound familiar? Really, of what value is gold that no one has or will accept as genuine?  Forget on paper. No one would ever trust it again, if a huge percentage of it is backed by absolutely nothing.

Look at it this way:

If you had gold to sell and everybody thought you'd never run out, but you did, and they were still demanding more and more of it, and all you had to do in response to their $1000 is send them a piece of paper with fancy words and impressive numbers on it, and you do have a limitless source of course, wouldn't you...ah....keep on selling and wallpaper your footprint with numbers to prove it?

Well, that's what Comex did.  They're only human.   

Once the belief of shortages becomes mainstream, everyone will test the response and wipe out whatever reserves they may be holding back for just such an emergency, but the overwhelming demand will be insatiable.  That's when the bubble bursts and gold gets a very bad name.  Is there any at all? Who among us would give up any of our supplies for what someone claimed was gold?  Given technology today, I'm sure someone has manufactured a synthetic that passes muster on parochial tests.

[SundownTown]

Jim Willie was going on about fraud and possible nondelivery at the COMEX earlier this year. "Where there's smoke there's fire", they say.

Wasn't there some gold in Canada that turned out to not be where it was supposed to be?

[Grinder63]

Jim Willie was going on about fraud and possible nondelivery at the COMEX earlier this year. "Where there's smoke there's fire", they say.

Wasn't there some gold in Canada that turned out to not be where it was supposed to be?

Here you go!

Tories call in Mounties over mint's missing millions
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/647671

Canada's money-makers can't find tens of millions in precious metals that are shown on the books.

[zwick]

Just a thought, but... what if a astronomical rise in the price of gold is what TPTB intend? By that I mean the rich banking families like Rockefeller and the crew at GoldmanSachs, and the Rochchilds, et-al? I'm putting my tin-foil hat on now, but if these critters own and hold most of the worlds gold, they would be calling the "new currency" shots after the dust settles over our corpses. All the fiat currencies are doomed. Yes, you can't eat gold, but you can rest assured that "They" will be enjoying beef while most will be eating the bark off of trees. People and states will be selling gold for food and it will end up in their possession. This is the end game for their plans, so after 20 or 30 years they own the entire world, literally. Wow, now that's some tin!

[Ming]

Sounds like another Bernie Madoff to me.  A Pyramid scheme.

[2handband]

There has been rumor - in the Fort Knox area - for years about the gold "supoosedly in Fort Knox.
I live near Fort Knox (about 30 miles away) - and used to work directly in the Fort Knox area (we heard military war games all of the time). So the people in the area talked about the Fort Knox gold - the rumors were that there was no gold in Fort Knox - or very little gold - I forget which.
Like I said this is all based on the rumors of people based on Fort Knox.

But several other people have wondered the same thing
a recent article
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article5989271.ece

not -so recent articles:
http://www.fgmr.com/right2know.htm

http://www.apfn.net/Doc-100_bankruptcy10.htm

I lived ON Ft. Knox for four years... did almost all of my high school there. I last saw the place in 1992. What town do you live in?

[Ming]

I found this article from Oct 2008 where it has alleged Comex's gold scam. 

Now, you have to ask yourself why this has not been investigated.   Too big to fail comes to mind.  If I had gold with them, I would certainly be demanding it pronto - or you'll be left holding onto worthless paper.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article7059.html

Comex Gold and Silver Markets Hurtling Towards Default
Commodities / Market Manipulation
Oct 30, 2008 - 02:06 PM
 
By: Jim_Willie_CB

 The COMEX gold & silver markets are each hurtling down a dangerous path toward default. The artificial paper price has created enormous physical demand, and hampered supply production, if not delivery. The gap between the JPMorgan-led corrupted phony paper price and the legitimate physical price in actual trading markets has grown sharply, enough to force a breakdown like in any distorted market. When December contracts in gold & silver are demanded to be satisfied via delivery of the metal, it will be clear that the COMEX is running a scam. A default is highly likely. Of course, they can continue to deny contract holders the right to benefit from delivery, as they have been doing for months to ‘Non-Economic Customers' but soon the ‘Commercial Customers' will be defrauded. Arrests are warranted. We will see how this corruption unfolds.

[Pidgey]

Some have raised the question of how to tell real gold from fake gold and whether anyone has come up with something that's indistinguishable from the real thing.  If you're concerned about any gold that you have or are considering buying, then check the specific gravity.  Here's a table of the specific gravities of various metals:

http://metals.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.reade.com/Particle%5FBriefings/spec%5Fgra.html

The simplest way is to weigh the sample on a scale that has a means of weighing said sample both in and out of water.  Some simple math will tell you the honest truth.  The other metals that have an SG near that of gold are worth a lot, too, with the possible exception of tungsten (I haven't looked into it).  I have used a standard triple beam balance scale with a thread lasso to weigh in water whatever it was that I was checking at the time.

In any case, it's not like gold has some transcendental value, it was always just good for coinage because it couldn't be counterfeited.  A working economy of some kind is still required for it to have any stable value for trading.

[ArmaGoof]

Some have raised the question of how to tell real gold from fake gold and whether anyone has come up with something that's indistinguishable from the real thing.  If you're concerned about any gold that you have or are considering buying, then check the specific gravity.  Here's a table of the specific gravities of various metals:

http://metals.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.reade.com/Particle%5FBriefings/spec%5Fgra.html

The simplest way is to weigh the sample on a scale that has a means of weighing said sample both in and out of water.  Some simple math will tell you the honest truth.  The other metals that have an SG near that of gold are worth a lot, too, with the possible exception of tungsten (I haven't looked into it).  I have used a standard triple beam balance scale with a thread lasso to weigh the in water whatever it was that I was checking at the time.

In any case, it's not like gold has some transcendental value, it was always just good for coinage because it couldn't be counterfeited.  A working economy of some kind is still required for it to have any stable value for trading.

Thanks for the info Pidgy.  I imagine all the potential recipients of "gold coins" out there who haven't a clue about what you just said.  I suspect the term "specific gravity" is NOT in most sheeples' vocabulary.  I for one, would not accept anything that could be suspicious, and, sans a SG contraption, I would never be secure enough in my conclusion to accept any trade.

[Grinder63]

Jim Willie was going on about fraud and possible nondelivery at the COMEX earlier this year. "Where there's smoke there's fire", they say.

Wasn't there some gold in Canada that turned out to not be where it was supposed to be?

Here you go!

Tories call in Mounties over mint's missing millions
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/647671

Canada's money-makers can't find tens of millions in precious metals that are shown on the books.

Here's an update on the above:

http://www.doomers.us/forum2/index.php/topic,48228.0.html

[Cherenkov]

Is this related to the rumors that American embassies around the world are being instructed to hoard local currency in anticipation of a major "event" in the next 150-180 days?

[houseoftang]

The simplest way is to weigh the sample on a scale that has a means of weighing said sample both in and out of water.  Some simple math will tell you the honest truth.  The other metals that have an SG near that of gold are worth a lot, too, with the possible exception of tungsten (I haven't looked into it).  I have used a standard triple beam balance scale with a thread lasso to weigh in water whatever it was that I was checking at the time.

I was thinking about this.  If you have a really accurate scale, like a reloading scale or a good triple beam balance (and you should have some check weights for it, too), get a small volumetric flask.  That's a flask that you can fill with a liquid and put a certain stopper in it, and it'll end up holding exactly a certain amount of water.  Make sure you can weigh the flask when full of water on your scale.

Now, weigh the "gold" out of the water.  Weigh the flask full of water, stopper in.  Put the gold in the flask, put the stopper back in.  Water will come out.

Either you can weigh the water that comes out, or you can dry off the flask and weigh it with the gold in it, and do the math to see whether your gold has the right specific gravity. 

Can anyone think of good ways to make this more accurate while staying low-tech?

[Macs UK]

It's at times like this (researching assay methods) that I learn what a quaint country I live in:

http://wapedia.mobi/en/Trial_of_the_Pyx

[houseoftang]

It's at times like this (researching assay methods) that I learn what a quaint country I live in:

Yeah, that's pretty cool.  Also researching assay methods a little here.  Found that folks are indeed using tungsten powder, which is denser than gold, mixed with a resin, and covering it with a little gold.

http://reactor-core.org/~djw/myblog/archives/2008/10/24/T12_14_56/

Easy to test with a volt-ohm meter (but that requires at least a little power).  There's also the "acoustic resonance test", which could probably be performed in a pretty unscientific way when dealing with tungsten-powder coins.  I doubt they'll ring like gold.

There's also the Fisch testers.

http://www.fisch.co.za/principle.html

Coin-specific (1 oz Kruggerand, etc), these both weigh the coin and determine the volume of a known coin (measures the thickness and diameter).  You could do the same with a caliber micrometer and a scale.  This wouldn't detect the tungsten fraud.

This brings up one point I've always believed.  Silver is better than gold in many ways, one of which is that it's not really worthwhile to elaborately fake silver coins, because they have a much lower value than gold, but take just as much time and effort to make.  It's well known that folks will try to counterfeit more expensive coins (numismatically speaking, not just the metal value) more often than lower value coins.  How often do folks make counterfeit $1 FRNs?  But counterfeit $50's and $100's are more common.  This is why I still hold that silver is better than gold for our purposes.

[Macs UK]

Dang, can't believe I put that last link in a "quote" tag 

silver is better than gold for our purposes

Well, we have various purposes, but a rough 'n ready calculation says an ounce of gold is worth about a kilo of silver... I know which I'd rather schlep in the BOB 

I think I'll ask my jeweller how she assays the coins on my next visit (being careful to sound inquisitive rather than accusative, of course  ) I know it involves a micrometer, accurate scales and a reagent in a little bottle she keeps just behind the counter... hmmm...