Ron Paul: Obama's 'goal' is economic collapse

[ralfy]

But what is the logic behind arguing that Obama's "'goal' is economic collapse" when the collapse took place before Obama became President? And why doesn't he talk about banks' exposure to over $100 trillion in derivatives or even the fact that the cause of the collapse was not government but banks playing casino capitalism? In fact, his advice given here:

http://ronpaulblog.com/2009/04/06/big-business-is-not-pro-capitalism/

is what caused the current collapse!

Ron Paul brings to peoples attention  many important issues that are usually not talked about. I think some of his views are more relevant now than ever before, regarding fiat currencies and gold standard.
I don't agree with him on all possible issues (as I am in the left), but I certainly like him a lot better than some of the other politicians.
He may be a social conservative, but I have never heard him say anything really wacky or crazy. (Not that social conservatives are wacky.)
I don't believe in his free market ideas, but I don't think he is like the  evil incarnate either.

I mean most politicians just use empty, flashy rhetoric to get what they want. Ron Paul actually talks about important issues. I guess this makes him a very controversial figure.

Thanks for the intellectual honesty.

I think you would be surprised how many issues we actually agree on.  The Left Right BS is a construct of the mechanism of control over a large populous.  If TPTB didn't give you at least 2 choices, we would revolt. 

I remember arguing with my dad when I was younger that Reagan wasn't doing what he talked about (my dad is a conservative).  Then I noticed that every admin since then has done basically the same thing....Consolidate more power in the Fed Gov and push more and more of us into Debt Slavery. 

We are basically falling into the same trap that the USSR did when they went after Afghanistan.  Our Empire building, policing the world, and interventionist military expenditures to pad the pockets of a few wealthy defense contractors and banks is crushing our economy.  P.O. is just the straw that is breaking the camel's back.  This is exactly what Bin Laden told us he would help bring about, and we played our part foolishly.

Thanks, highstreet & Peelo, for adding some substance to the discussion.  I actually voted for Ron Paul in the primaries, not because I'm a republican (I'm not) and I'm certainly not a racist (and I don't believe Paul is either), and I'm pro-women's rights (but Paul delivered 4,000 babies and is pretty adament about the right to life issue, but also said it should not be mandated one way or the other by the federal government), I'm not homophobic, and I seem to recall Ron Paul saying that the idea of "don't ask, don't tell" is pretty silly in the military, and it should be just "up front", etc., etc.

Because he has been such a thorn in the side of capitalism (and the military/industrial complex), everything he says or does is taken out of context and used by the propagandists to discredit him.  He's the only one in either party during the primary debates (with the exception of Kusinich on a number of issues) who was opposed to the Iraq invasion, believed that we should abolish the Fed, AND the income tax which feeds the fed, that we should stop policing the world, etc.  He was one of very few who voted against the Patriot Act.  He does not accept any contributions from lobbyists.

Do I agree with everything?  Of course not.  Do I think that even if he had been elected president that he could save us.  No, I don't.  But at least he's been consistent in his beliefs and has tried to be honest, based upon his beliefs, with the American people.  He's a dying breed.  (I'll admit that I caved to my progressive friends, who also thought Ron Paul is a kook, because they bought the MSM propaganda hook-line-and-sinker, and ultimately persuaded me not to throw away my vote, and I ultimately voted for Obama.  It felt good to see a black guy (or half black, half white guy) in the WH.  A moment of absolute flipannery!)

There was no chance in hell that either Ross Perot (who was equally vilified because even though a billionaire, he was self-made and a patriot -- whatever the fuck that means anymore) or Ron Paul would ever get nominated for the presidency.  Maybe they are both just a couple of old hacks who still believe in the Bill of Rights, out of date, and out of style. 

[highstreet]

But what is the logic behind arguing that Obama's "'goal' is economic collapse" when the collapse took place before Obama became President? And why doesn't he talk about banks' exposure to over $100 trillion in derivatives or even the fact that the cause of the collapse was not government but banks playing casino capitalism? In fact, his advice given here:

http://ronpaulblog.com/2009/04/06/big-business-is-not-pro-capitalism/

is what caused the current collapse!

He called Bush out on overspending for years while the R's and D's continued to vote for that spending.  This speech was specific to the Government spending, the war spending, and how the continued deficit spending will collapse our economy even further.  Obama has chosen to join Bush and those before him in propping up those very companies that caused this mess with the derivatives and others. 

As to the Banks, Paul says:
http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul486.html

"Another unsatisfying argument is that certain entities have to be bailed out because of their economic importance. Supposedly, some entities can be so big, so important, that no matter what they do, citizens must perpetually sustain them.

Even limited government has a basic duty to defend against force and fraud. Some argue that force is somehow permissible just because the entity engaging in it is "economically significant." But one could use this reasoning to prop up slavery. It could be deemed unfortunate but economically beneficial, and indeed these arguments have been used historically to deprive people of their liberty. But slavery should never be tolerated regardless of any economic benefit, just as systemic fraud should not be tolerated. Some banks on Wall Street should fail. Fannie and Freddie should fail. They are perpetrating fraud against the people. Yet, government insists on rewarding behavior which should instead be investigated, prosecuted, and punished."

Paul on Bush's TARP:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/3qLefrvxbq8&amp;ap=%2526fmt%3D18&amp;rel=0" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/3qLefrvxbq8&amp;ap=%2526fmt%3D18&amp;rel=0</a>

Here's an interview where he talks about the derivatives and bailouts:
http://www.foxnews.com/search-results/m/20949784/ron-paul-on-aig-s-emergency-loan.htm

Your link to that blog doesn't have any of Paul's statements on the subject, maybe you were trying to link another article.

[mtlouie]

BTW, he is no racist. 

Um, yes he is.  You must have missed the video someone linked the other day somewhere on the forum.  The man is a southern racist.  Sorry.

From the very beginning all I could think was:  he's another Ross Perot.  Split the Republican vote to get the Democrat elected.  I suppose because the Democrat is meant to be there for a reason?  Bill Clinton was there for his payoff on the Mena, Arkansas/Iran-Contra deal.  I have no idea what Obama's deal is.  Maybe he's just supposed to be the token black in there as the country collapses so the white racists can go ape shit.  Or maybe he really is one of them.  Whatever, he's a tool of empire, so to me it doesn't matter what his reasons for being elected to the most powerful job in the world really are.

But Ron Paul?  Come on.  If he was really a danger he'd end up like Paul Wellstone.  Ever read Mike Ruppert's 'Crossing the Rubicon'?

[highstreet]

BTW, he is no racist. 

Um, yes he is.  You must have missed the video someone linked the other day somewhere on the forum.  The man is a southern racist.  Sorry.

From the very beginning all I could think was:  he's another Ross Perot.  Split the Republican vote to get the Democrat elected.  I suppose because the Democrat is meant to be there for a reason?  Bill Clinton was there for his payoff on the Mena, Arkansas/Iran-Contra deal.  I have no idea what Obama's deal is.  Maybe he's just supposed to be the token black in there as the country collapses so the white racists can go ape shit.  Or maybe he really is one of them.  Whatever, he's a tool of empire, so to me it doesn't matter what his reasons for being elected to the most powerful job in the world really are.

But Ron Paul?  Come on.  If he was really a danger he'd end up like Paul Wellstone.  Ever read Mike Ruppert's 'Crossing the Rubicon'?

I have read about Wellstone, and I own the Rubicon.  Great book.

Paul's not even from the South.  He was born and grew up in Pennsylvania.  He went to school in NC and MI, and finally moved to TX to open his medical practice after his military service.  Do you even read or click on the links I provided? 

Does a racist suggest Walter Williams as his VP?


Here's Nelson Linder, Director of the NAACP in Austin, TX on Anti-War radio about Ron Paul:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvFLSwDvBUA (External Embedding Disabled)

[mtlouie]

I didn't mean he was from the south.  I should have phrased that correctly.  He is a typical southern-type racist.

I watched your vid.  I also watched a bunch of other vids put up on you tube along with yours.

All I heard was:  Constitution, Constitution, Constitution.  "He's a Constitutionalist!"

When I hear them say "He's a Bill of Rights-ist!" then I'll be willing to listen a little harder.  The Libertarian/Constitionalists in my state are racist lunatics.

Oh, I also heard a bunch of other stuff.  Like exactly what I thought:  He's playing his part in the script.

He even looks a little like Ross Perot.

Re: The head of the NAACP: Hilarious.  They've even got the NAACP thinking they're part of the elite.  The United States is finito.   

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[highstreet]

I didn't mean he was from the south.  I should have phrased that correctly.  He is a typical southern-type racist.

I watched your vid.  I also watched a bunch of other vids put up on you tube along with yours.

All I heard was:  Constitution, Constitution, Constitution.  "He's a Constitutionalist!"

When I hear them say "He's a Bill of Rights-ist!" then I'll be willing to listen a little harder.  The Libertarian/Constitionalists in my state are racist lunatics.

Oh, I also heard a bunch of other stuff.  Like exactly what I thought:  He's playing his part in the script.

He even looks a little like Ross Perot.

Re: The head of the NAACP: Hilarious.  They've even got the NAACP thinking they're part of the elite.  The United States is finito.   

He's one of the only Bill of Rightist other than Kucinich.

They were the only two presidential candidates who voted against the Patriot Act.
Paul also voted against the Military Commissions Act, and spoke out against the Warrantless Wiretaps. 
And if you know who Naomi Wolf is, then you might know that Paul was the only legislator brave enough to introduce the American Freedom Agenda Act put forth to protect our Rights and outlaw Torture and Rendition.

[graveday]

RP is nothing if not consistent.  I am taking this out of context, but it is still cautionary.  "Consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds

He has many salutary positions that result from his no abortion stance.  He has been in politics for almost forty years and he is elected again and again, in Texas.  He has a message and it has not changed for almost forty years.  Can you say the same about yourself?

[Madnsassy]

Whatever anyone thinks about Ron Paul, the individual, it's at least important to take a look at his legislation, HR 1207, to create law which enables congress to audit the fed.  http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/audit-the-federal-reserve-hr-1207/

If you watch the short video, the last 30 seconds tells it all.  Ron Paul says that the chairman of the federal reserve bank is more powerful than the president of the US.  The Fed can control trillions of dollars without appropriations and oversight.  They're certainly more important than congress.

Mama always said:  don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.   

[graveday]

Not trying to throw him anywhere.  I love that Bernanke has to respond civilly to him. 

Did you see that thread where it was mentioned that JFK was outfoxing the Fed with some silver shenanigans and restraining the national debt in a big way, and got himself killed.  Interesting to consider the building that the bullets supposedly came from.

[Madnsassy]

Not trying to throw him anywhere.  I love that Bernanke has to respond civilly to him. 

Did you see that thread where it was mentioned that JFK was outfoxing the Fed with some silver shenanigans and restraining the national debt in a big way, and got himself killed.  Interesting to consider the building that the bullets supposedly came from.

Even more interesting was one of JFK's speeches, which many have never heard:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnQntSgLkAo (External Embedding Disabled)

[Pegasus]

Not trying to throw him anywhere.  I love that Bernanke has to respond civilly to him. 

Did you see that thread where it was mentioned that JFK was outfoxing the Fed with some silver shenanigans and restraining the national debt in a big way, and got himself killed.  Interesting to consider the building that the bullets supposedly came from.

Even more interesting was one of JFK's speeches, which many have never heard:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnQntSgLkAo#noexternalembed

That speech has been used in countless conspiracy theory movies.  He's talking about Communism and it eerily sounds way too much like what is going on now.

[graveday]

Back to Ron Paul.  The title begs this answer for Ron Paul's goal.  Being elected again, some forty years now.  He speaks well to Texans outside of Austin.

[wildrabbit]

Back to Ron Paul.  The title begs this answer for Ron Paul's goal.  Being elected again, some forty years now.  He speaks well to Texans outside of Austin.

And that pretty much says it all.